Anime Sharing - Netorare General Discussion Thread

[MerrilMan]

One of greatest moments of NTR!!! ... Remember to vote for NTR products!!!

Why would you bother voting for the chance that someone else may machine translate a game, when you can do it yourself in a few seconds?

 

[Shadovv]

Really? Did you MTLed engines not supported by mtool, like OyakoRankan's? Without textractor, which is painfully slow. Here we have working out of the box.

 

[MerrilMan]

Really? Did you MTLed engines not supported by mtool, like OyakoRankan's? Without textractor, which is painfully slow. Here we have working out of the box.

Oyako Rankan works perfectly with textractor though. And ITHVNR before that. I've never used MTool for anything, there's no real reason too. And even then, why wait around hoping that somebody else will do it for you?

 

[Shadovv]

Oyako Rankan works perfectly with textractor though. And ITHVNR before that. I've never used MTool for anything, there's no real reason too. And even then, why wait around hoping that somebody else will do it for you?

Dude, what textractor? There is always delay GAME-->Textractor-->TranslationSolution.
OyakoRankan (it was an example) is already MTLed for free. English text appears instantly and is in the game, not in separate window.
But other games, like Moirai's await translation.

This is big QOL change!

 

[Namkapple]

Why would you bother voting for the chance that someone else may machine translate a game, when you can do it yourself in a few seconds?

I don't get this either. It's not like the barrier to entry to translate games yourself is particularly hard. I have said this before, and I'll say it again. It's these kinds of zero standard lowest common denominator people that have ruined the hentai space. I'm getting so sick of the MTL being pumped out left and right. Not to mention said MTL producers ask for money and donations and you have actual people paying up. It's insane.

 

[MerrilMan]

Dude, what textractor? There is always delay GAME-->Textractor-->TranslationSolution.
OyakoRankan (it was an example) is already MTLed for free. English text appears instantly and is in the game, not in separate window.
But other games, like Moirai's await translation.

This is big QOL change!

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here, as there's no meaningful delay to the process of the hooking or translation of text that I've ever encountered (if that's what you mean). And yes, I played Oyako Rankan with ITHVNR years and years ago, that's hardly new. And really, cramming MTL'd text back into a game is just a terrible idea. You cannot alter the inputted text on the fly, you cannot use various useful tools like substitutions to ensure a consistent translation of unique terms, you do not have the original Japanese at hand to use with dictionaries, nor can you do anything about any and all mistakes left in. And if you absolutely need to fullscreen your eroge, then textractor has its overlay function anyway.
Like Namkapple says, I just find it utterly bizarre that people would purposefully choose to be this lazy.

 

[Animefan_09]

I thought the point was that it used Sugoi to translate wich is better than google and deepL, or maybe some fancy new AI transaltor that is better (i saw mention of one recently that was a huge improvement with AI trans).

Anyway i see a couple of game i want to try (mostly BISHOP and Liquid) so long as is better than google i am ok with it............hopefully Triangle Blue and othe rLilim games get translated too xD

PS: Mtool is getting very popular recently but the free version as many limitations like size and using only google, so if this circunvents those i do see some use for it

 

[Namkapple]

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here, as there's no meaningful delay to the process of the hooking or translation of text that I've ever encountered (if that's what you mean). And yes, I played Oyako Rankan with ITHVNR years and years ago, that's hardly new. And really, cramming MTL'd text back into a game is just a terrible idea. You cannot alter the inputted text on the fly, you cannot use various useful tools like substitutions to ensure a consistent translation of unique terms, you do not have the original Japanese at hand to use with dictionaries, nor can you do anything about any and all mistakes left in. And if you absolutely need to fullscreen your eroge, then textractor has its overlay function anyway.
Like Namkapple says, I just find it utterly bizarre that people would purposefully choose to be this lazy.

What they mean with delay I think, is the output delay. I'm assuming here, so I could be wrong.

Hooked text in current text box - > gets sent to tl program(google, deepl, yandex, etc...) -> depending on the text and maybe your PC, it can take anywhere from 1-5 secs for it to translate and then appear in textractor.

essentially this is/can be a limitation, sure, but imo it's not a big one at all. Especially due to the freedom you get from it. It only truly becomes an issue when you hold down CTRL to skip text and the program ends up trying to tell multiple paragraphs worth of text. Google is still instant or relatively fast more or less. DeepL is the one with the lag so to speak.


All in all imo it's not a problem but I can see how some people can be annoyed by it over the long run. I don't think sacrificing this for a lack of Jap text and someone else's MTL is a worthwhile trade as MerrilMan put it.

 

[Redorc]

There is almost no delay with deepl or google, but there can a big one if you use a local translator like the sugoi model, as depending on your hardware it can be up to 20s-30s or even more, or crash, and make your pc slow as hell at the same time.
Personally I don't use any of these mtool thingies as I prefer sending to clipboard then either reading or sending to deepl, but I can see the point of mtling the thing if it's EDITED mtl. I wouldn't be interested since I played these games anyway, but for someone who wants to play offline where sugoi is the only choice, I can see the point. (Actually there is also ATLAS v14 with fhc legendary wacky dictionary if you're around here since long enough... and if you like 80% nonsense.)
The choice sadly is not between mtl and proper translation for any of these niche nukige, it's usually between nothing or mtl, with edited mtl probably the best anyone can hope for.

 

[Shadovv]

I thought the point was that it used Sugoi to translate wich is better than google and deepL, or maybe some fancy new AI transaltor that is better (i saw mention of one recently that was a huge improvement with AI trans).

Anyway i see a couple of game i want to try (mostly BISHOP and Liquid) so long as is better than google i am ok with it............hopefully Triangle Blue and othe rLilim games get translated too xD

PS: Mtool is getting very popular recently but the free version as many limitations like size and using only google, so if this circunvents those i do see some use for it

Mtool does not support most VNs at all.

On top of that, the guy who translates keeps the data ready for-re translation. So when Sugoi 6,10,2090, whatever pops up with better MTL, this guy has already most work done and can release better MTL.

(not related to quoted Animefan, it is about some other people):
BTW. I see some malcontency here from some people, some people fail to see that for many users such hardcoded MTL is first acceptable experience for VNs/games with NTR.

It is zero-effort (just replace files from archive)
It has no delay AT ALL - you some people here state this was not an issue with extractors - for me and some other people it is an issue.
It is offline and private. Deepl/Google monitors everything and some VNs surely trigger (falsely) some alarms.
Ability to change a translation with online stuff is a niche request.
The text is where it belongs, not in some rectangle next to the game. Also, while some stuff remains untranslated anyway, patched-MTL has more text translated than hooked online one. Online/hooking translating is a lot less immersive.

I think I said enough, cause malcontents will surely attack the project anyway, no point to say all reasons over and over. The users will decide themselves what they want and I am sure what it will be.

PS. Some people are whining about someone put an effort for modern HQ MTL (not Google's "poetry") and ask for an OPTIONAL donation, delivering patches for free.
In case you think MTL is an cancer or sth, feel free to provide actual translation. And ofc never ask for money, since asking for the money for work, time, effort is so bad.

 

[Namkapple]

>HQ MTL with Sugoi
The amount of copium is crazy. Go to sadpanda and look at uploads that claim they have been done with Sugoi. It is still littered with errors. You want to translate it via MTL? Great. Just keep it to yourself imho.

Again you have to look at the bigger picture. If more and more people end up not caring cause its "good enough" this pervasive mindset is seen by corporations/bottom feeders that want to farm e-peen points and will be exploited. Because companies don't care, they just want the least amount of effort put in with the maximum profit. And since most of the fanbase is/will end up being this brain dead zero standard majority, the hobby ends up becoming a shallow husk. Want examples? I can give you a few.

1. Webnovel: It is all MTL now, they barely even take the time to edit it. Why? Because brain dead apes keep paying for it, or just donating because they want to "support". This goes beyond webnovel though. Almost every KR, CN, JP novel is MTL'd now.
2. Irodori: This fucker's DMCA aside (it has ruined the doujin scene), but I digress. His translations are either sometimes incorrect or censored
3. Random manga off the top of my head: Saikyou no Maou ni Kitaerareta Yuusha, Watashitachi, Rikon Shimasu, bocchi the rock, Tsui no Taimashi: Ender Geister, 99% of korean webtoons, etc....

Go to mangadex click on some manga and just check some uploads from people. You can find single person teams, so one person, upload translations of a series in Chinese, Korean and Japanese, while being ESL themselves. It's absolutely insane.

To quote a user from Sadpanda: SSincere

There's a concept in economics known as Gresham's law, which, stated most briefly, is "Bad money drives out good." What this means that if you have two different kinds of money in circulation -- one being "good money", like a silver coin whose face value is close to the bulk value of the metal, and the other "bad money", like paper bills that don't have intrinsic value -- that the "good money" will be replaced in circulation by the "bad money", as people hoard the "good money" for its bulk value and only circulate the "bad money". This can apply to two different monies issued by the same government, or to precious metal coinage versus debased/devalued versions of the same, or to real versus counterfeit bills. It's pretty easily illustrated in the US: prior to 1964, dimes and quarters were made with some percentage of real silver, and once the mint switched to base metals, the older, silver coins rapidly left circulation. They were collected for their bullion value, and the new, less valued coins took their place.

It's not a perfect fit, but the metaphor can certainly extend to these scanslations -- if a "good" fan translator has the time and opportunity to work on one of two doujinshi, one with no translation at all and one that already has a "bad" translation, from a purely return-for-investment perspective, it makes more sense for them to translate the new book. This is how "bad", and even "good enough", are the enemies of the "best".

On the other hand, at least bad money circulates.

I can't say if this is a bad thing or good thing definitively. As it has some pros. In my opinion, though, it is a negative all-in-all.

When things become popular/mainstream/corporations get their teeth in a hobby. It explodes. This is great because you see an initial boom of content that is well made, or in this case translated. As the years go on. Due to more and more people falling in love with the hobby, people want more content and want it sooner.
>More manga/anime/doujins/VN etc.. is getting made
>more people in the hobby
>want more content
>want the content fast
So this is what you get. Quantity over quality. I can consume more manga, anime, doujins than ever before. I'm never lacking content. On the downside the type of content being produced (in my subjective opinion) is sub-standard, and the translation of said content is lacking too.

 

[JokerXY]

anyone have 0.41 for fujino sao game?

 

[indifferent]

So....almost no one here uses texthookers to read kanji through furigana? I wrongfully thought everyone was doing it like me.
I mean it makes sense now that I look back whenever people complained how google translate or deepl were not working with their texthooker setup, I just never connected the dots and thought only new members here were MTLing and frequent members were texthooking only for furigana so seeing everone mtling is a bit surprising.

And the situation with machine translation taking over all the eastern porn and comics we consume is sad but there is not much we can do about since most people want things translated fast no matter how bad as opposed to good translation which could take years even.
I don't think this mtl fervor is stopping. I see it like people pre-ordering games, no matter how many times high budget games release in a broken state people still pre-order cause they are impatient.
As for me, I know I won't have to bother with any texthooker or suffer mtled doujins after I become proficient with kanji.

 

[Namkapple]

So....almost no one here uses texthookers to read kanji through furigana? I wrongfully thought everyone was doing it like me.
I mean it makes sense now that I look back whenever people complained how google translate or deepl were not working with their texthooker setup, I just never connected the dots and thought only new members here were MTLing and frequent members were texthooking only for furigana so seeing everone mtling is a bit surprising.
.

How in the world you thought that most members here were ONLY using texthooking as a means to learn kanji is wild. I don't know how anyone comes to that assumption. I don't think any rational person ever comes to such a conclusion.

 

[LordFrz]

I doubt you thought that and just wanted to flex that your better then everybody. Thats what that sounds like. I'll take your word for it, but thats sounds pretentious AF.

 

[indifferent]

How in the world you thought that most members here were ONLY using texthooking as a means to learn kanji is wild. I don't know how anyone comes to that assumption. I don't think any rational person ever comes to such a conclusion.

Cause I'm much more dumber and slower than I would like to admit. I was introduced to VNs through fuwanovel and vn reddit and people there, atleast the ones I talked to, recommended me to study hiragana katakana and grammar to start reading through texthooker and I never doubted them and did that and foolishly thought people here were doing the same thing. I thought people went throught the exact same experience as I did before arriving to this niche ntr genre of this niche visual novel format because I'm stupid and not rational.

I doubt you thought that and just wanted to flex that your better then everybody. Thats what that sounds like. I'll take your word for it, but thats sounds pretentious AF.

Unconsciously I might have wanted to flex cause I know I'm not above flexing but it's also true that I thought most people here were doing like me and using furigana. Learning a new language is hard and I'm sorry to have start flexing once I learned people here didn't know as muh japanese as I thought.

I seem to have struck a nerve and I apologize to you two as you can clearly see I lack the emotional and rational maturity not flex secretly and also be not stupid as I'm.
Feel free to call me out whenever and I'm galdly accept my wrongdoing.

 

[Redorc]

So....almost no one here uses texthookers to read kanji through furigana? I wrongfully thought everyone was doing it like me.
I mean it makes sense now that I look back whenever people complained how google translate or deepl were not working with their texthooker setup, I just never connected the dots and thought only new members here were MTLing and frequent members were texthooking only for furigana so seeing everone mtling is a bit surprising.

I do a mix of both, as sometime I'm just too horny to lookup every word :D

 

[greenlittleman]

Does anyone know how to hook this game and others from the same developer?
https://www.dlsite.com/maniax/work/=/product_id/RJ396470.html

To answer my own question, I found an app called Agent that helps with hooking all "difficult" engines easily. Just google Agent text hooking or something. It has a translation tool included, but its interface isn't suitable for using as you read a vn. I just use textractor (for MTL) and translator aggregator (for dictionary and original text) with it, as it seems to "save to clipboard" automatically.

 

[indifferent]

I do a mix of both, as sometime I'm just too horny to lookup every word :D

I can relate. Sometimes I'm too horny to even bother with setting up my texthooker and just starts a game thinking I know enough japanese to play through an H-scene I already completed but after the first few kanjis I give up reading and only focus on the heroine's voice to know what's going on. She can read kanjis for me lol.
Btw, how is your texthooker set up?

Mine is Textractor + TA(Translation Aggregator) or sometimes ITHVNR + TA.
And my TA windows are Mecab and JParser. Mecab is for furigana but sometimes it breaks a kanji into smaller kanji making it confusing or it doesn't even register some kanjis. So JParser is for covering up the shortcomings of Mecab and gives much more detailed definitions of kanjis. But JParser is also not perfect as it doesn't register several kanjis too specially(in my case) kanjis for dirty words which I had to look up on the net each time till I was forced to memorize.

So I'm hoping if someone can recommend a better setup than mine who uses texthookers for furiganas and kanjis only.

 

[Redorc]

I can relate. Sometimes I'm too horny to even bother with setting up my texthooker and just starts a game thinking I know enough japanese to play through an H-scene I already completed but after the first few kanjis I give up reading and only focus on the heroine's voice to know what's going on. She can read kanjis for me lol.
Btw, how is your texthooker set up?

Mine is Textractor + TA(Translation Aggregator) or sometimes ITHVNR + TA.
And my TA windows are Mecab and JParser. Mecab is for furigana but sometimes it breaks a kanji into smaller kanji making it confusing or it doesn't even register some kanjis. So JParser is for covering up the shortcomings of Mecab and gives much more detailed definitions of kanjis. But JParser is also not perfect as it doesn't register several kanjis too specially(in my case) kanjis for dirty words which I had to look up on the net each time till I was forced to memorize.

So I'm hoping if someone can recommend a better setup than mine who uses texthookers for furiganas and kanjis only.

Mine is different, more complicated but it's generalized to learn Japanese (from anime or games), and keep in mind I don't care about furigana, I learn the words instead :

In normal mode
Textractor to hook the game
+ send to clipboard textractor extension

+ using a dedicated chromium browser for JP learning -> https://chromium.woolyss.com/ (yes the website is legit, dude just compiles chromium builds for you, note that you can use something like brave if you don't want to use chromium, as long as it's based on it and has access to the chrome webstore)
+ using clipboard inserter extension (reason why I recommend to use a dedicated browser, you don't want that in your usual browser) -> https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/clipboard-inserter/deahejllghicakhplliloeheabddjajm
+ using yomichan (with added JP dictionaries) to lookup each word -> https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/yomichan/ogmnaimimemjmbakcfefmnahgdfhfami
(note : you can also use Rikaichamp that has built in dictionaries if you don't care about voice over, or sending the definitions to third parties -> https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/10ten-japanese-reader-rik/pnmaklegiibbioifkmfkgpfnmdehdfan )
+ using a special web page that grasps clipboard stuff and writes it, so that you can look up any word you want. -> online https://texthooker.com/ or offline https://github.com/jhunschejones/Texthooker-Local

It sounds complicated and all, but really it's very simple once it's set up, and using web pages to look up is way better than whatever mecab can do.
It looks like this :
1- you launch the game
2- you hook it with textractor
3- you launch your chromium browser and you browse to the texthooker page
5- you start both yomichan/rikaichamp and clipboard inserter
And that's it, each sentence is now copied to the browser and you can look anything!
Since all sentences are inside the browser, you can even use a furigana extension if you'd like.


My horny mode :
Same as above but I just use deepl textractor extension to quickly check what's being said.

 

[PotatoGod]

To answer my own question, I found an app called Agent that helps with hooking all "difficult" engines easily. Just google Agent text hooking or something. It has a translation tool included, but its interface isn't suitable for using as you read a vn. I just use textractor (for MTL) and translator aggregator (for dictionary and original text) with it, as it seems to "save to clipboard" automatically.

I can vouch for this if you're using it for Tyrano script. Its pretty consistent and easy to use despite the fact it looks confusing at first.

 

[indifferent]

snip

Thank you! This might be better than the method recommended by vn reddit due to having a dedicated browser. On their guide I was also apprehensive about being online to read but here it seems Rikaichamp runs offline with Texthooker Local(unless I've misinterpreted something) which is good. But now my net is also stable there is no problem either way.
And yeah, furigana is a bad habit of mine. I had JParser but my eyes always went to Mecab first due to laziness. I'll make a point to not use furigana extension on this setup.

Again, thank you.

 

[Prettz]

was looking at くるみぷりんと blog and he was talking about what he thinks makes a good NTR game https://ci-en.dlsite.com/creator/16156/article/834641

story
"It is the fundamental element of the work.
If the story is good, the characters will be good and the worldview will be good.
On the other hand, if the story is bad, neither the characters nor the worldview will stand up, so it may be the most important element.
In the case of NTR works, it is the relationship between the heroine and the hero,
The relationship between the heroine and the hero.
The encounter with the interloper and the process of falling.
The process of meeting and falling with the interloper, and the degree of fall after the fall.
I think that the story is divided into three factors.
There are many masterpieces that have these three factors well depicted.
MTSP's works are very erotic because they depict these factors well.
"

Direction (erotic text, erotic scene)

"In NTR works, this basically refers to the text and presentation of erotic scenes.
It also includes the heroine's voice from her mind, and the hero's gasping voice heard through the wall.
The heroine's voice, the heroine's gasp heard through a wall, the heroine's reflection on an erotic site that is suddenly opened, something happening behind a door, shadow pictures through a sliding door or curtains, etc. are also examples of direction.
In the case of games, there are many things that can be done here.
Items, meaningful erotic status, animations, etc. can be used in various ways.
"

Worldview.

"The environment or expanse that makes up the work.
A work that is set in the present day is likely to receive a good score for worldview because it is connected to the players, but if the development is too far off the beaten path or the story is too unrealistic, a worldview must be presented in the story.
On the other hand, if it is a fiction or fantasy world, it is necessary to explain the premise, etc., so it is necessary to devise a convincing worldview.

In games, maps and characters are important in the worldview.
So there is a correlation between the characters and the story, so a good worldview will relatively increase the scores of the story and characters."
translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)

found it an interesting read. their more to the blog then this as well.

 

[Kaizoku]

About 完堕ちＸ寝取られ家族/ Sex-loving family

there is a survey from the developers, you can tell them your opinions, there are some questions like about your favorite character, your favorite genres ..etc (ask them for more NTR games and netorare games and maybe swapping and netorase games!

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSf4_5B-Oqk6B0OdzueJa0hDba5Ru47WQttHYvK6Wf5VubwoJA/viewform

 

[stupid_army]

amyone have played [吹溜] バウンティハンター キョウカ ? Is it good?